• Dr.Kats posted an update

      9 months ago (edited)

      Victory 🏈

      In the below gem of a Krehl paper, our entire work to here that culminated in nicotinic acid + free L-tryptophan as the two limiting nutrient precursor factors is corroborated along with the calculation for the relative mass ratio of how the two should be coming exogenously co-supplemented.

      If you are interested in understanding exactly how the above is so, please thoroughly review the paper (linked below to accessible full PDF published) and inquire about it.

      TRYPTOPHANE STUDIES

      I. THE EFFECT OF NIACIN ON THE UTILIZATION OF TRYPTOPHANE*

      BY W. A. KREHL, J. DE LA HUERGA, AND C. A. ELVEHJEM

      (From the Department of Biochemistry, College of Agriculture, University of Wisconsin, Received for publication, April 29, 1946)

      https://www.jbc.org/article/S0021-9258(17)41258-0/pdf

      jess and mrs-n-of-one
      6 Comments
      • 83377 (edited)

        So, corn is the problem – do not eat corn.
        “…Good growth is obtained with non-corn niacin-low diets”
        Does that mean tryptophan alone is adequate for growth and niacin synthesis, with non-corn diet ?!.

        Answer to Next post from DA. Bender et al, please!

        • Dr.Kats (edited)

          @83377 The problem is not specific to corn. Krehl showed how you can mimic same situations without corn as example like via just tryptophan-low or absent proteins or by heat acid-washing them which destroys the free fraction as opposed to up to 5 hours of heated NaOH base hydrolysis or just hot water, to retain the l-tryptophan after cleavage.

          What Krehl showed is that bottom line it comes down to the content of tryptophan and niacin. By adding a calculated amount of corn (in this case 40%) to a pre-existent basal diet containing 15% casein, while keeping the total calories of diet the same, you shift the protein content proportion to 12.4% and with this, lose the proportional amount of tryptophan contained in that difference now replaced with calories from corn. Before, with that extra tryptophan still there in 15% casein without corn, it was enough to make sufficient NAD+ as well as whatever else it needed to do even without any niacin, for the sake of generally ok development to still ensue. Losing that much tryptophan and not correcting it with enough exogenous free nicotinic acid from Merck (or free L-tryptophan) forces then that less tryptophan available in 12.4% vs. the greater amount from previously 15% casein that though just barely still was sufficing for that need for development as well as NAD+ to now have to divert a greater proportion to make NAD+ in lieu of niacin while also continue to provide enough remaining tryptophan for all its other duties as before, which that less tryptophan from 9% casein simply can’t do (again, unless the additionally needed free crystalline nicotinic acid and/or L-tryptophan is supplemented).

          • Total protein fell from 15.0% → ~12.4%, and calculated Trp from 180 → 128 mg per 100 g diet (≈29% drop). Growth dropped accordingly until either 1.0–1.5 mg/100 g nicotinic acid or ~0.05% free L-Trp was added, which rescued growth. That tryptophan added exogenously amount as free-form L-tryptophan did not need to be that high, note. Nonetheless, it was enough.

            • Less Trp in the ration + no preformed niacin forces a higher fraction of the smaller Trp pool into kynurenine → NAD⁺, leaving less for protein synthesis and 5-HT→melatonin—and growth stalls.

            • Add back enough free crystalline nicotinic acid niacin to meet the NAD⁺ requirement to spare Trp for its other jobs.

            • Add back the needed amount of free L-tryptophan exogenously: you increase the substrate enough that some can be diverted to NAD⁺ and still cover protein/5-HT needs.

            Corn merely worsens this general problem because (i) maize protein (zein) is Trp-poor, (ii) all “niacin” from diet like maize or anything else is already converted down, so there is no free-form usable actual niacin aka free crystalline nicotinic acid in diet (meanwhile, exogenously more nicotinic acid is needed to be supplemented to counter the streptothrycin in the dye of corn along with L-tryptophan for the sulfa they add on top of the streptothrycin as with “corn grits” which is covered up with the tale that goes something like, “niacin that corn provides is in a non/bioavailable bound form”), however, the core lever is still the combined amount of free-form crystalline nicotinic acid + L-tryptophan available.

            Think of two knobs you can turn to keep development/metabolic function intact:

            1. Niacin/NAD+ knob (Preiss-Handler pathway-derived NAD⁺): set high enough that NAD⁺ demand is covered so Trp isn’t siphoned off beyond more than that has to be.

            2. Tryptophan knob (substrate): ensure sufficient Trp density so its non-NAD⁺ roles (protein, serotonin→melatonin) aren’t insufficiently powered or become compromised.

            Many dietary patterns (corn, low-protein, acid-washed proteins) can depress one or both knobs, essentially really in some way manifest the essential-for-life/function requirement for exogenous free-form nicotinic acid and/or L-tryptophan to have to be supplemented to a countering degree (if NAD+ requirement becomes great enough, then both free-form nicotinic acid and L-tryptophan together, as in real-world settings).

            We can frame it as: exogenously supplemented relevant amount of free nicotinic acid or free L-tryptophan can rescue to some degree, but the full counter that is the best outcome is achieved by maxing out free crystalline nicotinic acid amount supplemented that covers the NAD+ requirement so Trp is spared best and ideally further; even accumulating in a free pool as storage surplus to feed its need for growth tissue and serotonin/melatonin axis.

            Trying to meet NAD⁺ needs only with Trp demands large Trp flux, starving serotonin/melatonin and protein synthesis. Hence the strategy: let NA do the heavy lifting.